Threatening me on Ebay is NOT cool

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Sewingroom57
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Re: Threatening me on Ebay is NOT cool

Post by Sewingroom57 »

I hope you carry on and ignore this very rude person ,l can only say she is jealouse l would not know where to start with making a reborn never mind a silicon that is why l am a collector and not an artist and nobody forces us to buy somthing we do not like we just carry on untill we find something we do like and l do hope you make it there is plenty of room for every one out there.
Angelica
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Re: Threatening me on Ebay is NOT cool

Post by Angelica »

Well I have just read this thread..
not me on EBay Mike.. thanks for making that clear ..
To my very long time friends, many trusted buyers and sellers, you can reach me by email
But this forum is no longer a place I want to be ..
and I am going to use a line from the Truman show
"And if I don't see ya.. Good afternoon, Good Evening And Goodnight!"
(For Truman Show fans.. my boat has hit the fake sky and a door has just opened and I am going through it...
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Court_LLRN
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Re: Threatening me on Ebay is NOT cool

Post by Court_LLRN »

Angelica wrote:Well I have just read this thread..
not me on EBay Mike.. thanks for making that clear ..
To my very long time friends, many trusted buyers and sellers, you can reach me by email
But this forum is no longer a place I want to be ..
and I am going to use a line from the Truman show
"And if I don't see ya.. Good afternoon, Good Evening And Goodnight!"
(For Truman Show fans.. my boat has hit the fake sky and a door has just opened and I am going through it...

Angelica, I really wish you wouldn't go. I don't know what has been going on behind the scenes but from what I've read, I do support your opinions you've made on the threads. And I know others do too.
Presentation-wise, there are problems on both sides. But you do very much have support.
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Sally
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Re: Threatening me on Ebay is NOT cool

Post by Sally »

I hope you are happy now that you have got one of my favourite ladies to leave the forum.
I have read this ....and all the other topics in this subject....and I am speechless.
You should learn to respect collectors who know what they are talking about.
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Luv Sally xx
chelle77
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Re: Threatening me on Ebay is NOT cool

Post by chelle77 »

Julia89 wrote:



Sorry but People DO speak bad about him and make fun :( and I think it is cowardly to speak in Back It is better to speak directly even it is hurt sometimes this is Honest in my Opinion.
There is a difference in giving someone criticism in a helpful manner and throwing words at someone in order to humiliate,threaten or cause pain. The first you do out of a sense of decency~the second you do out of lack of character.
Therein lies the difference in this case,imo.
MariaJose and Zu
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Re: Threatening me on Ebay is NOT cool

Post by MariaJose and Zu »

Please Angelica, stay here, we are many who support you and we appreciate you as a friend and collector. :heart: :hug:
Ignore stupid, envious and hypocritical comments.
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Zu, forever in my heart :heart:
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cookielover
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Re: Threatening me on Ebay is NOT cool

Post by cookielover »

I don't really have an opinion on most of what has been said on this post. I am sad to hear that any members feels so unhappy that they will leave DF. I hope that Angelica will reconsider her decision. We need all the good people we can get! I think one of the basic problems is how DF has changed since I joined around 2010 or so... then it was mainly for collectors and artist to interact, talk, give opinions, and have fun. It was a fun place to come and chat with friends about our mutual hobby. Now it seems to have become a site for selling and buying where offense is taken for all sorts of things -- some meant to offend and others offending just by their very being on DF. Too bad. We seem to be retreating to our corners to nurse our perceived hurts. It saddens me to see the direction that DF is going. We need all the good people we can get. JMO Ruth
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Re: Threatening me on Ebay is NOT cool

Post by MikeTheEngineer »

cookielover wrote:I don't really have an opinion on most of what has been said on this post. I am sad to hear that any members feels so unhappy that they will leave DF. I hope that Angelica will reconsider her decision. We need all the good people we can get! I think one of the basic problems is how DF has changed since I joined around 2010 or so... then it was mainly for collectors and artist to interact, talk, give opinions, and have fun. It was a fun place to come and chat with friends about our mutual hobby. Now it seems to have become a site for selling and buying where offense is taken for all sorts of things -- some meant to offend and others offending just by their very being on DF. Too bad. We seem to be retreating to our corners to nurse our perceived hurts. It saddens me to see the direction that DF is going. We need all the good people we can get. JMO Ruth
I've received around two dozen PM's about how they hate how nasty, vicious and intentionally mean people are on these forums. Most have said they've left and returned at least once. And now, they never post or chat, except to sell/buy via PMs.
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Re: Threatening me on Ebay is NOT cool

Post by MikeTheEngineer »

UPDATE:
Listing finished without incident
No pictures were removed by myself nor ebay
Ebay did not contact me

I suspect ebay had a good laugh at whomever reported it, as practically all the dolls are posed/pictures too similar for a non-doll person to distinguish. And since the person that reported it also sells the similar products... they probably thought it was quite self-serving.

I did not cave to the PC-police, and it seems Ebay wasn't intimidated by them either. That's a victory for sane, reasonable people everywhere.

I thank everyone that has supported me, and appreciate your kind words.
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Re: Threatening me on Ebay is NOT cool

Post by MikeTheEngineer »

Second update: The ebay thug has changed her User ID to: sellerunavailable as of two days ago.
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Dion
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Re: Threatening me on Ebay is NOT cool

Post by Dion »

:heart: Angela, I hope that you will change your mind and not leave Doll Fan. You have always been a stellar Doll Fan member and I would truly miss you if you leave. You WERE accused unfairly. That would make me angry, too, and so I do understand. You were NOT the person on EBay that Mike said caused him trouble, but he did erroneously say that you "probably" were when he had no evidence whatsoever. That was a false accusation, as the person on EBay causing him trouble was not you. I am hoping that you will reconsider. We have had too many of our precious DF friends leave over the years. This too shall pass, Sweetie. Please stay.

:foryou: Hugs and Blessings, Dion
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Re: Threatening me on Ebay is NOT cool

Post by avigrace96 »

Enough is enough. I contacted Mike via eBay to request that he remove certain photos of the doll in which it was posed inappropriately. Yes, a doll is a doll but these dolls represent real children and like another user said, you would never photograph a real child like that. I thought about commenting here, but so many others had already and his responses refused to address the issue. I did not and do not have anything against his doll, just the way it was posed and the fact that those photos were introduced to the public, which makes the hobby look perverted. I thought he might respond differently on the actual site of sale, and since I was going to report the listing to eBay, I thought I would give him the benefit of the doubt first. For the record: I have never reported a buyer. But when something like this comes up, do you turn a blind eye? Also for the record, he did NOT share the actual message I sent. Rather an edited version in his favor, removing plenty of context. This was not only unfair to me, but to all of YOU. Especially those who commented in his favor, when he blatantly lied about the situation. When I said "I am a member of Doll Fan and other doll sites." It was to say I knew better when he stated I was the "only one" to report that I found the poses to be sexualized. Which would have been obvious had he not conveniently cut that out. Lies, lies, lies. When I said I would never endorse his products or speak anything but ill of them, it was because of these lies. Same as an artist saying they've never had paint issues or don't use copied kits- it is fair to let other collectors know if they are dishonest. Not saying I would go out of my way to do so... I DO NOT find myself to be "Al Calpone of the dolly gang." I did, however, speak for more than myself in saying the large majority felt rubbed the wrong way and I realize that now. I apologize to anyone who I spoke for unintentionally. When I said "You would do well to learn to take advice." I meant from everyone, not just myself. And I am now taking advice from many of you, especially Izzy who was right that the best thing to do is take a step back from the computer and regain composure. After reading her post, I realized I shouldn't have continued contact with this user and that, in the future, if I have something to say I should say it with class. I did tell this user he was "insane" and "wacky" in response to being repeatedly told I am an "evil" person, in addition to his suggestion that I am some sort of predator, which is RIDICULOUS. This reflects poorly on me, and I regret getting so heated in the message exchange. However, I don't think I was wrong about that. To come on here and start a full thread lying about what I said, in an attempt to victimize himself and detract from the scrutiny he was facing with many others, is almost unfathomable for a 32 year old adult and self-proclaimed genius. To create a witch hunt for me as someone who said less than most about his listing- with people sharing where I live, what I buy etc. crosses a line. That is why I changed my username. I am not an "eBay thug." Many of you have done business with me. Or I comment on your posts, genuinely enthused to see your work or collections. I admit my wrongs for name-calling in my following response but I certainly did not harass him as he has claimed. All of this drama was unnecessary and unfair to other users.
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MikeTheEngineer
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Re: Threatening me on Ebay is NOT cool

Post by MikeTheEngineer »

Dion wrote::heart: Angela, I hope that you will change your mind and not leave Doll Fan. You have always been a stellar Doll Fan member and I would truly miss you if you leave. You WERE accused unfairly. That would make me angry, too, and so I do understand. You were NOT the person on EBay that Mike said caused him trouble, but he did erroneously say that you "probably" were when he had no evidence whatsoever. That was a false accusation, as the person on EBay causing him trouble was not you. I am hoping that you will reconsider. We have had too many of our precious DF friends leave over the years. This too shall pass, Sweetie. Please stay.

:foryou: Hugs and Blessings, Dion
I did have circumstantial evidence, which is why I said probably, and believe. I never said she IS. And when she said she wasn't in another thread, I relayed that to this one. And regardless of whether or not she was the ebay person, her initial comments on my For Sale post was *way* out of line.
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Re: Threatening me on Ebay is NOT cool

Post by MikeTheEngineer »

avigrace96 wrote:Enough is enough. I contacted Mike via eBay to request that he remove certain photos of the doll in which it was posed inappropriately. Yes, a doll is a doll but these dolls represent real children and like another user said, you would never photograph a real child like that. I thought about commenting here, but so many others had already and his responses refused to address the issue. I did not and do not have anything against his doll, just the way it was posed and the fact that those photos were introduced to the public, which makes the hobby look perverted. I thought he might respond differently on the actual site of sale, and since I was going to report the listing to eBay, I thought I would give him the benefit of the doubt first. For the record: I have never reported a buyer. But when something like this comes up, do you turn a blind eye? Also for the record, he did NOT share the actual message I sent. Rather an edited version in his favor, removing plenty of context. This was not only unfair to me, but to all of YOU. Especially those who commented in his favor, when he blatantly lied about the situation. When I said "I am a member of Doll Fan and other doll sites." It was to say I knew better when he stated I was the "only one" to report that I found the poses to be sexualized. Which would have been obvious had he not conveniently cut that out. Lies, lies, lies. When I said I would never endorse his products or speak anything but ill of them, it was because of these lies. Same as an artist saying they've never had paint issues or don't use copied kits- it is fair to let other collectors know if they are dishonest. Not saying I would go out of my way to do so... I DO NOT find myself to be "Al Calpone of the dolly gang." I did, however, speak for more than myself in saying the large majority felt rubbed the wrong way and I realize that now. I apologize to anyone who I spoke for unintentionally. When I said "You would do well to learn to take advice." I meant from everyone, not just myself. And I am now taking advice from many of you, especially Izzy who was right that the best thing to do is take a step back from the computer and regain composure. After reading her post, I realized I shouldn't have continued contact with this user and that, in the future, if I have something to say I should say it with class. I did tell this user he was "insane" and "wacky" in response to being repeatedly told I am an "evil" person, in addition to his suggestion that I am some sort of predator, which is RIDICULOUS. This reflects poorly on me, and I regret getting so heated in the message exchange. However, I don't think I was wrong about that. To come on here and start a full thread lying about what I said, in an attempt to victimize himself and detract from the scrutiny he was facing with many others, is almost unfathomable for a 32 year old adult and self-proclaimed genius. To create a witch hunt for me as someone who said less than most about his listing- with people sharing where I live, what I buy etc. crosses a line. That is why I changed my username. I am not an "eBay thug." Many of you have done business with me. Or I comment on your posts, genuinely enthused to see your work or collections. I admit my wrongs for name-calling in my following response but I certainly did not harass him as he has claimed. All of this drama was unnecessary and unfair to other users.
You are the one consistently lieing.
You were *THE FIRST* to come up with such non-sense that it was posed sexually.
You ARE LIEING that it's the only doll you've EVER seen in that position. I could find 10+ on ebay and 5+ on Etsy with very similar poses and photographic angles. And to say no one photos a child in the same position... is ABSURD. It's exactly where you'd be when changing a diaper. And plenty of parents will photograph right after cleaning up messy diaper. (Except some of your more prudish countries out of FEAR from people like you who report innocent things as if they were crimes.)

I did not add or chance any words you sent me. Those were your EXACT words. Context surround threats and demands is irrelevant, they should *never* be done.
Demanding I do WHAT YOU TELL ME, because omg, your safe space has been intruded.. and *GASP* a doll has "offended" you, under threats of HARM qualifies as an act of evil. Demands and threats are the type of thing that criminals do.

Your Wrong doing has nothing to do with the name calling. It was insulting to call my listing sexual. To make demands under threat of harm is your wrong doing.

If you would have approached me with some class, and said, hey, someone might get the wrong idea with one of your pics, can you try from another camera angle... I would have. But that's not what you did. You and Angelica both came at me, right out of the gate, with aggressive, hostile behavior. That overbearing attitude may work on weak-willed individuals unwilling or unable to stand up for themselves, but doesn't work on me.
But ya know... As I told you, I *CANNOT* remove a pic once a bid is made.

You changed your EBAY because you felt the shame that you should for your attack on me, and my hard work. The light of day is the greatest disinfectant.
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Dion
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Re: Threatening me on Ebay is NOT cool

Post by Dion »

There was nothing disrespectful at all in your first message or the others, Victoria, but there was sarcasm and defensiveness in Mike's response. There is no way that anyone could know or even guess what the other "2000" people who looked at the doll were thinking. A lot of people who don't like something or are offended by something, don't take the time to write to the seller.

It was very nice of you to post when you didn't have to, Victoria. There was nothing wrong with you expressing how you felt about the pictures. You were being honest and respectful, and there is nothing wrong with that. If you got angry and called a few names later, I understand that, too! It took courage to come forward and I really respect and honor that a great deal. :toast:

:foryou: Blessings, Dion

Just read your last post, Mike. Not nice at all. To say that parents take pictures of their child's genitals after changing a diaper is ridiculous. The more you write the worse you sound.
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Re: Threatening me on Ebay is NOT cool

Post by grandmasheryl »

Changed my mind Mike you are not a very nice person.
You purposely misconstrued what was written to you. You are like a petulant child when asked to change something.
You stomp your feet, then start lashing out.
At this point in time I think maybe we as a group should petition Steve to remove you from dollfan completely.
You CANNOT accuse a person on a PUBLIC forum without proof!
You did that so you credibility is shot.
So where does that leave us?
Time for other dollfan members who feel as I do to ask Steve to remove Mike from dollfan.

After reading and rereading your posts Mike I am seriously suspects of you true reason and what market you are actually trying to reach with your creations .
Especially in light of how you feel the poses you put it in for pics is perfectly natural.
I showed my husband the pics ,his perception of the pics was the same as many here
Clearly not appropriate for depicting a baby. Before you smart off about other people's "evil" minds. My husband worked with abused and exploited children so I trust his judgment far more than I would yours
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NadiaK
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Re: Threatening me on Ebay is NOT cool

Post by NadiaK »

I really think it's time for Steve to lock this post. Time to move on.
Hugs,
Nadia

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chelle77
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Re: Threatening me on Ebay is NOT cool

Post by chelle77 »

Well seeing the conversation in it's entirety I would like to apologize to the Ebay poster
It never occurred to me that parts would be left out as to not get the whole picture of what transpired :roll:

Sometimes when given an opinion it is best to respond with a bit of humility and not go into attack mode. I think it could have all been avoided if Mike's response had been different... :?
MariaJose and Zu
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Re: Threatening me on Ebay is NOT cool

Post by MariaJose and Zu »

Yes, Nadia. This is causing more and more pain and discomfort. Any moderately intelligent person has had enough time to give himself a picture of who each one is and what his intentions are.
But it would be fair if Mike apologizes to Angelica.
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Zu, forever in my heart :heart:
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